Sep 12, 2023 Planning and Zoning Commission

[00:00:06]

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>> CHAIR: GOOD EVENING LADIES AND GENTLEMEN.

WELCOME TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING MEETING OF TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 12, 2023. SHOW 7:02 PM AND WE WILL CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER. AS AUTHORIZED IN SECTION 551071 OF THE TEXAS GOVERNMENT CODE, THIS MEETING MAY BE CONVENED INTO CLOSED EXECUTIVE SESSION FOR THE PURPOSE OF SEEKING CONFIDENTIAL LEGAL ADVICE FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY ON ANY AGENDA ITEM HER HEREIN. THE CITY OF ROWLETT RESERVES THE RIGHT TO CONVENE, RESIST OR REALIGN THE REGULAR SESSION OR CALL EXECUTIVE SESSION TO THE ORDER OF BUSINESS AT ANY TIME FOR BUYER ADJOURNMENT. PROCESS FOR PUBLIC INPUT.

IF YOU ARE NOT ABLE TO ATTEND IN PERSON, YOU MAY COMPLETE THE PUBLIC INPUT FORM BY THE CITY'S WEBSITE BY 3:30 P.M.. ALL FORMS WILL BE FORWARDED TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION PRIOR TO THE START OF THE MEETING.

OKAY, WE WILL CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER.

ITEM NUMBER TWO, CITIZENS INPUT.

AT THIS TIME, I WILL TAKE A THREE MINUTE COMMENTS FROM ANYONE IN THE AUDIENCE ON ANY TOPIC.

NO ACTION CAN BE TAKEN BY THE COMMISSION DURING CITIZENS INPUT. DO WE HAVE ANYONE HERE TO SPEAK

[3. CONSENT AGENDA]

DID EVERYONE HAVE A CHANCE TO REVIEW THE MINUTES? ANY CHANGES, COMMENTS? WE ARE READY FOR A MOTION.

>> I WILL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES.

>> CHAIR: WE HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES AS

SUBMITTED. >> I SECOND.

>> CHAIR: WE HAVE A SECOND. ALL IN FAVOR?

[4A. Consider and make a recommendation to City Council on a request by Spiars Engineering, Inc. on behalf of property owner Oden Hughes, LLC. for approval of a Tree Removal Permit on a property zoned Form-Based Urban Village (FB-UV). The 22.48-acre site is located approximately 1600 feet south of Main Street west of President George Bush Highway in the City of Rowlett, Dallas County, Texas]

MOVING TO ITEM 4, ITEMS FOR INDIVIDUAL CONSIDERATION.

FOR A, CONSIDER AND MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO CITY COUNCIL ON A REQUEST BY SPIARS ENGINEERING, INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INCORPORATED INC. ON BEHALF OF PROPERTY OWNER ODEN HUGHES, LLC. FOR APPROVAL OF A TREE REMOVAL PERMIT ON A ROPERTY ZONED FORM-BASED URBAN VILLAGE (FB-UV). THE 22.48-ACRE SITE IS LOCATED APPROXIMATELY 1600 FEET SOUTH OF MAIN STREET WEST OF PRESIDENT GEORGE BUSH HIGHWAY IN THECITY OF ROWLETT, DALLAS COUNTY, TEXAS.

>> THIS IS A REQUEST FOR A TREE REMOVAL PERMITBY THE COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT PART DEPARTMENT . THIS IS ACTUALLY PART, I WILL TRY TO ESCRIBE THIS A LITTLE BIT . THIS IS PART OF PHASE APPROVAL CALLED TO DOWNTOWN EAST THAT INCLUDES THE APARTMENT PROJECT CALLED 190 MAIN LOCATED AT MAIN STREET CURRENTLY UNDER CONSTRUCTION.IT WOULD ALSO HAVE RETAIL THAT IS PLANNED FOR RETAIL OR COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT FOR THE FRONTAGE ROAD AND ALSO THROUGH THAT PLAN, THIS PROPERTY HERE WAS GRANTED ENTITLEMENT FOR MULTIFAMILY ON THE TRACK AND BEING DEVELOPED NOW. SIMILARLY, RETAIL IS PLANNED FOR THE TWO TRACKS ON BUSH TURNPIKE.

>> MADAM CHAIR. MAY I ASK STAFF A QUESTION, PLEASE? JUST REAL QUICK, IN THIS PLAN, IS THERE A TIMEFRAME FOR THE COMMERCIAL PERSONNEL?

>> THERE IS NOT A TIMEFRAME FOR THAT.WE HAVE HAD SOME DISCUSSIONS WITH POTENTIAL PROJECTS TO DEVELOP ON SEVERAL OF THOSE PARCELS, BUT NOTHING AT THIS POINT HAS BEEN

PSUBMITTED. >> I FEEL LIKE WE ARE GETTING CAUGHT GOING DOWN THE SAME ROAD IN THE PAST WHICH IS WHERE WE APPROVE A PROJECT WHICH IS RESIDENTIAL COMMERCIAL AND THE RESIDENTIAL PORTION CONTAINS A LOT OF THE APARTMENTS.

WE SEE THE APARTMENTS BUT NONE OF THE COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT.

>> THE APPROVAL FOR THAT. IT'S MY TIME WITH THE CITY.

I WAS NOT PART OF THAT. THAT IS LIKELY A LARGE PART OF WHY WE HAVE THE REQUIREMENT FOR THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT TO

[00:05:01]

THERE ARE 150 TREES ON THE SITE THE TOTAL 2099 CALIPER INCHES.

OUT OF THE STREETS, 140 THAT ARE CONSIDERED TO BE PROTECTED PER THE FORM-BASED CODE. THOSE TREES HAVE A TOTAL OF 1873 CALIPER INCHES. THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING TO REMOVE 133 OF THOSE TREES COMING TO A TOTAL OF 1789.5 CALIPER INCHES. THE FORM-BASED CODE AUTHORIZES MITIGATION CREDITS FOR SAVING OR PRESERVING ANY PROTECTED TREES, AND FOR TREES THAT ARE PAINTED WITH DEVELOPMENT ALONG THE STREETS WITHIN THE OPEN SPACES AND ALONG ANY TRAILS.

ALSO, I MITIGATION CREDIT OF 4:1, MEETING FOR CALIPER INCHES MEDICATED FOR EVERYONE THAT IS SAVED.

AS FOR ANY PROTECTED TREES BETWEEN EIGHT AND 23 CALIPER INCHES. THE SEVEN TREES THAT THEY PROPOSING TO PRESERVE TO QUALIFY UNDER THAT.

THEY WILL RECEIVE A 4:1 MITIGATION CREDIT.

THE SEVEN TREES TOTAL 81.3 CALIPER INCHES.

THE CREDIT IS 344 INCHES. IN ADDITION, THERE WILL BE 125 TREES, HAVING A COMBINED CALIPER INCH TOTAL OF 375 INCHES PLANTED ON THE STREETS WITH NEW OPEN SPACES.

I PUT THEM ON TRAILS THAT YIELD AN ADDITIONAL 375INCHES .

IN ADDITION, SECTION 212 905 OF THE TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE REQUIRES CITY TO OFFER MITIGATION CREDITS FOR ANY PPLANTED TREES THAT ARE TWO CALIPER INCHES OR BETTER.

THIS CREDIT ISTARGETED AT 50% OF THE CALIPER INCHES THAT ARE PLANTED . BECAUSE THE FORM-BASED CODE DOES GRANT MITIGATION CREDIT FOR ALL TREES THAT ARE THREE CALIPER INCHES GREATER, THE 50% CREDIT ONLY APPLIES TO TREES BETWEEN TWO CALIPER INCHES AND THREE CALIPER INCHES.

THE ADDITIONAL MITIGATION CREDIT YIELDS $11,180.71 THAT WILL BE SUBTRACTED FROM THE REPAYMENT OF THE REFORESTATION

FUND. >> THIS IS THE FIRST TIME THAT I HAVE SEEN THIS WAY OF CALCULATING.

WHY IS THAT? >> THIS THE FIRST TIME THAT THIS CREDIT HAS BEEN REQUESTED OF US .

IT IS NOT SOMETHING THAT WE ARE REQUIRED TO GIVE TO EVERY APPLICANT AUTOMATICALLY. THEY MUST MAKE THIS REQUEST OF US. ADMITTEDLY, IT IS A SECTION OF THE STATE GOVERNMENT CODE THAT WE ARE UNAWARE OF.

I WILL BE STRAIGHTFORWARD ON THAT .

WHEN HIS APPLICANT BROUGHT THIS FORWARD TO US, WE HAD TO COORDINATE WITH OUR CITY ATTORNEY TO FIGURE OUT WHAT OUR RESPONSIBILITY WASUNDER THE CODE .

THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE ON HOW TO APPLY THIS.

THAT IS THE DIRECTION WE WERE GIVEN FROM HIM IS THAT THE TREES THAT ARE, WE NEED THE REQUIREMENT UNDER THE STATE LAW WHICH WE INCLUDED IN THE INFORMATION WITH THE PACKET FOR PROVIDING THAT 50% CREDIT BECAUSE OF THE CREDITS WE OFFER FOR TREES THAT WE ARE PLANTING FOR THE FORM-BASED CODE.

THE TREES LESS THAN 2 INCHES DO NOT COUNT TOWARDS THE FORM-BASED CODE, SO WE MUST GIVE CREDIT AT A 50% RATE FOR THOSE TREES BETWEEN TWO AND 3 INCHES.

[00:10:05]

>> IS THIS RETROACTIVE TO OTHER TREES?

>> IT WILL NOT BE RETROACTIVE. THE READER UNDER STATE LAW PER OUR CITY ATTORNEY IS THIS IS SOMETHING THAT THE APPLICANT

MUST ASK. >> THANK YOU.

>> IT HAS BEEN A WHILE SINCE WE HAVE HAD THOSE BEFORE US.

MAYBE WHEN THE DEVELOPER COMES FORWARD, HE CAN TALK TO US ABOUT WHEN THEY WILL BE DOING SOME COMMERCIAL PROPERTY IN THE FRONT. IF THEY ARE NOT DOING ANY COMMERCIAL PROPERTY WITHIN THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS, THERE IS A MAIN ROAD THAT LEADS INTO THE NEW DEVELOPMENT THAT THEY WANT TO PUT IN. CAN TREES BE PLANTED THERE,

EVEN THOUGH IT IS COMMERCIAL? >> WE CAN TALK ABOUT THAT AT THIS POINT. AT THIS POINT IN TIME, THEY ARE NOT SHOWING ANY OF THOSE TREES THAT THEY WILL BE PLANTING BECAUSE DEVELOPMENT IS NOT HAPPENING ON THAT SITE.

YOU MAY ASK THE QUESTION AS TO WHETHER YOU COULD CONSIDER PROVIDING ADDITIONAL TREES ALONG THE ENTRYWAY.WITH THIS SCHEMATIC HERE, THE YELLOW CIRCLES ARE TREES THAT THEY ARE PLANTING WITH THE DEVELOPMENT. THE STREET TREES PER THE CODE.

PURPLE TREES ARE LOCATED WITHIN OPEN SPACES AND THE GREEN CIRCLES PLANTING THAT ARE 2 INCHES OR GREATER OR IN THE PARKING LOT BUT DON'T COUNT TOWARDS THE MITIGATION CREDIT.

HOWEVER, THEY CAN UNDER THE TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENTCODE .

THAT IS WHAT THIS DIAGRAM IS INDICATING.

THIS IS THE CHARTER GOING THROUGH WHAT I JUST LAID FORWARD. IT BEGINS LAYS OUT THE REQUEST , STARTING OFF OF 1873 CALIPER INCHES OF PROTECTED TREES ON SITE. THEY ARE GRANTED UNDER THE FORM-BASED CODE AND THE REMAINING CALIPER INCHES THAT WOULD NOT BE MITIGATED BY PLANTING ON SITE ARE 1080.5.

THEREFORE, MULTIPLY THAT BY THE - -4 CALIPER INCH YIELDING $131,464.43 PAYMENTS INTO THE REFORESTATION FUND.THE SECOND HALF TO THIS WOULD BE THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE.

THE ADDITIONAL 183 INCHES THERE PLANTING BETWEEN TWO AND THREE PCALIPER INCHES WOULD BE 183 TIMES 8.5 BECAUSE IT'S A50% CREDIT . MOST WHY THAT BY 121.67, YIELDING $11,032 CREDIT TOWARDS THE MITIGATION FEE.TAKING INTO CONSIDERATION, THE CREDITS ALLOWED FOR THE FORM-BASED CODE AND THE REQUIRED CONTRIBUTION WILL BE 131 464.

THE TREE MITIGATION CREDIT ALLOWS FOR AN ADDITIONAL MITIGATION CREDIT OF 11,000 $130.81.

SUBTRACTING THAT FROM THE CALCULATION UNDER THE FORM-BASED CODE YIELDS A NET MITIGATION FEE OF $120,331.62.

THE PLANNING AND ZONING MAY RECOMMEND DENIAL IF THEY DETERMINED THE REMOVAL OF THE TREES ARE NOT REASONABLY REQUIRED FOR CONDITIONAL - - CIRCUITRY OR THE PURPOSE AND INTENT OF THE SUBCHAPTER IS NOT BEING MET BY THE APPLICANT.

STAFF DOES RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THIS PERMIT BASED ON THE APPROVEDDEVELOPMENT PLAN . THE REMOVAL OF THESE TREES IS NECESSARY TO ACCOMMODATE THE PROPOSED CONSTRUCTION AS WELL AS A RELATED PUBLIC INFRASTRUCTURE.

THE APPLICANT IS HERE THIS EVENING TO ANSWER QUESTIONS THAT YOU MAY HAVE OF THEM, AS WELL AS WE AS STAFF ARE HERE TO

ANSWER QUESTIONS. >> THANK YOU ALEX.

DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF BEFORE HE TAKES A SEAT? OKAY, THE APPLICANT, OR DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING?

[00:15:05]

>> I HAVE A QUESTION ALEX. HAVE ANY CALCULATIONS BEEN DONE ON THE RUNOFF THAT IS GENERATE ?

>> THAT COMES UP THROUGH THE CIVIL ENGINEERING PLANS.

I BELIEVE THEY ARE IN PROCESS NOW, WE'LL HAVE MARTIN TAKE THAT FOR US. IF THERE IS A REQUIREMENT FOR ANY ON-SITE MITIGATION OF COURSE OR DETENTION, THAT WILL BE A REQUIREMENT THAT WOULD MODIFY.

THE APPLICANT CAN SPEAK TO, IF THEY KNOW THEY WILL HAVE SOME REQUIREMENT FOR INITIAL ON-SITE DETENTION.

>> OKAY, THE TREE ROOTS SYSTEMS HELP REDUCE EROSION, RIGHT?

>> THEY TENDS TO DO THAT, YES. >> ALRIGHT, NO MORE QUESTIONS.

>> THANK YOU ALEX. THE APPLICANT CAN COME UP.

IF YOU WILL STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE MINUTES?

>> SPEAKER: DAVID GOTTMAN WITH OHD PARTNERS.

ALEX COVERED A LOT OF IT, BUT I WANTED TO GIVE QUICK BACKGROUND ON OUR GROUPS. WE ARE A CLASS A MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT AND CONSTRUCTION COMPANY THAT BUILDS BEST IN CLASS COMMUNITIES AROUND TEXAS. WE ARE CURRENTLY UNDER CONSTRUCTION FOUR MULTIFAMILY - - HIGHEST QUALITY IN THE MARKET. WE PURCHASED THE SITE NINE MONTHS AGO AND DESIGNED AS YOU ALSO, A THREE AND 46 UNIT PROJECT THAT INJURES TWO RESORT STYLE POOLS, RESORT STUDIO, STATE-OF-THE-ART FITNESS CENTER.

OUR CIVIL ENGINEERIS HERE COME HIS NAME IS DAVID .

THE LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT WORKS WITH CITY STAFF OVER THE LAST FEW MONTHS TO FOLLOW THE APPROVED READINESS PLAN ASSOCIATED WITH THIS SITE. WE PERFORMED A TREE SURVEY AND UNDERSTOOD THAT THE TREE REMOVAL PERMIT WAS REQUIRED.

AS ALEX EXPLAINED, WE WILL PLANT 97 3 INCH TREES, 17 4 INCH AND 110 INCH TREE. THAT MAP THAT ALEX WENT THROUGH GETS US TO THE MITIGATION FEE OF $120,000.

WE HAVE COME TO AGREEMENT ON THIS FEE.

DAVID AND MYSELF ARE HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS AND ONE THAT I THINK WILL COME UP IS ABOUT THE COMMERCIAL UPFRONT.

ALL WE DO IS BUILD APARTMENTS. THE WHOLE PIECE IS 22 ACRES IN TOTAL AND WE WILL ADDRESS EACH OF THE COMMERCIAL HAPPENED UP THERE. WE ARE ACTIVELY MARKETING AT THE MOMENT. IN OUR EXPERIENCE WITH RETAIL BECAUSE WE GET THAT QUESTION A LOT, IS PROVIDING DENSITY FIRST THING IS THERE ARE ROUGHLY 700 APARTMENTS, SEEING THAT DENSITY USUALLY LOWERS THAT MAN. WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE SOMETHING HAPPEN THERE AND WE ARE ACTIVELY WORKING ON IT.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR COMMISSIONERS, ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? MR. ENGEN.

>> I WILL ASK THE QUESTION. FIRST, I AM GLAD YOU ARE ACTIVELY LOOKING FOR COMMERCIAL, BECAUSE IT IS A GREAT AREA FOR RESTAURANTS TO BE IN THAT AREA.

CAN YOU PLANT TREES? AT LEAST IT WOULD IDENTIFY AN AREA OR A STREET TO HAVE ACCESS INTO YOUR APARTMENT.

>> CAN WE PLANT TREES AND THE TWO FRONT ENTRANCE?

>> YES, FROM GEORGE BUSH GOING BACK TO YOUR DEVELOPMENT.

>> WE COULD, BUT I WOULD HAVE TO WORK ON IT WITH DAVID TO MAKE SURE IS NOT AWARE OF ANY UTILITIES BECAUSE I AM PUTTING IN UTILITIES ALONG WITH THE ROAD SYSTEM THAT IS GOING IN.

>> THE PART WAS WE ARE UNSURE OF THETIMING OF ANY OF THOSE COMMERCIAL FOLKS . NOT DEVELOPING THOSE FRONT TWO PADS, IF SOMEONE WANTS TO START AND DO THE NORTHEAST CORNER, WE ARE AT THAT OPEN SPACE WHICH WOULD BE IDEAL FOR OUTDOOR RESTAURANTS, PATIOS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

WE CAN DO A SITUATION WHERE WE ARE COMMITTING TO BUILD THE TREES FOR THEM AND NEED TO CLOSE OUR PROJECT.

IT CREATES A LOT OF HEADACHES QUITE HONESTLY.

I WILL BRING US BACK TO OUR SLIDE HERE, ONE MOMENT.

[00:20:05]

ANYWHERE YOU LIVE HERE, WE TRUST THAT UP AS NICELY AS WE CAN. IN OUR VIEW, IT'S A LITTLE BIT PREMATURE TO COMMIT TO - - CONNECTIONS, POTENTIALLY OFFICE USERS ALONG THE INTERIOR STREETS.

THAT'S WHY THIS BLOCKS DOWN TO SEETHE BACK COMING IN .

HOPEFULLY WE ARE ABLE TO MIRROR THAT WITH THE RETAIL PARTNER IN THE FRONT. HER DAY ONE, WE ARE BUILDING OUR HALF OF THE STREET. [INAUDIBLE].

A LOT OF WHAT YOU SEE, THE REASON IT COMES OUT IS SANITARY SEWER AND STORM SEWER. WE CAN ACCOMPLISH THIS BLOCKING WITH THE LAND THAT IS TELLING THOSE UTILITIES.

THERE IS NO WAY TO SAVE ANY OF THOSE TREES AND GET THE STREET LAYOUT AND STREET GRID SET FOR US WILL ME STARTED.

IF YOU ARE GOING TO ASK ABOUT THE EROSION, IT CAME TO MY MIN

. >> I AM VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE EROSION AND THE RUNOFF. THE TREES PROVIDE MITIGATION TO EROSION. WHAT CALCULATIONS HAVE YOU DONE

REGARDING THAT? >> A COUPLE OF THINGS.

NOT NOTED IN ANYTHING PRESERVED IS WITHIN THE GREENBELT BETWEEN THE TWO PROJECTS. THEY ARE NOT ON-SITE, SO WE DID NOT SURVEY ANY OF THOSE TREES. I BELIEVE IT'S ABOUT 2.5 TO 3 ACRES. THE TOTAL NUMBER OF INCHES, WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS TO BE HONEST WITH YOU.

EVERYTHING THERE IS BEING PRESERVED WITH THE ROADWAY.

YOU SEE IT UP AT THAT ROADWAY. AS FAR AS STUDIES, IT HAS BEEN A DOWNSTREAM FLOOD STUDY THAT GOES DOWN TO THE LAKE THAT HAS BEEN PERFORMED. IT HAS BEEN ACCEPTED BY THE CITY AND IT SHOWS THE CAPACITY OF THE SYSTEM ALL THE WAY DOWN TO MILLER HEIGHTS IS SUFFICIENT.

AT MILLER HEIGHTS, THE DEVELOPER IS IN PARTNERSHIP WITH THE CITY TO UPSIZE THAT CROSSING.

IT'S ABOUT ONE FOURTH MILES EAST OF THE PROJECT.

YOU SHOULD SEE THAT GOING TO CONSTRUCTION VERY SHORT.

THAT IS THE DONE ANCILLARY TO THIS TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE ARE NO FLOODING ISSUES. WHEN YOU LOOK AT, IS THERE A DEFINED PATHWAY? WE HAVE THE CREEK HERE THAT SHOWS IT IS ADEQUATE FOR THE SITE THAT IS FULLY DEVELOPED.

>> THE CREEK ON MILLER HEIGHTS IS DAMMED UP, THE WATER DOES NOT FLOW AND BACKS UP TO THE ADJACENT PROPERTIES.

>> PART OF THE STUDY AND I RECOMMEND MENTIONED RECOMMENDED UPSIZING THAT WEATHER CHANNEL GOES DOWN BY THE LAKE.

>> NOT JUST WHERE THE CHANNEL PROCESS, IT IS STILL GOING TO BACK UP ON THE RESIDENCE PROPERTIES.

>> IT HAS BEEN DREDGED SOUTH OF MILLER HEIGHTS.

THAT PIECE TO THE NORTH RUNS THROUGH THE CITY PROPERTY.

[00:25:10]

>> IS ALL DAMMED UP AND STILL FLOATS.

>> I WOULD HAVE TO SPEAK WITH JEFF.

>> GETTING BACK TO YOUR NUMBERS, THE REMAINING CALIBER INCHES THAT YOU ARE NOT MITIGATING IS 1080.5.

WE HAVE THE SITUATION ON MILLER HEIGHTS WHERE THATCREEK FLOODS . SO, YOU ARE GOING TO TAKE AWAY 1080 CALIBER INCHES OF EROSION CONTROL THAT THESE - -. HOW ARE YOU GOING TO CONTROL THE FLOODING? IF THE CREEK DOES NOT FLOW BECAUSE IT IS DAMMED UP WITH DEBRIS AND TREE TRUNKS AND TREE LIMBS, IT DOES NOT FLOW.

IT BACKS UP TO THE RESIDENCE PROPERTIES.

>> I WOULD HAVE TO LOOK AT IT WITH YOU.

I HAVE WALKED THAT PERSONALLY FROM THE MILLER HEIGHTS CROSSING AND I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU ARE SPEAKING OF.

>> WHERE THE CREEK IS THAT GOES TO THE LAKE.

THAT CREEK BACKS UP ONTO THE ADJACENT PROPERTIES AND IT ALL GOES UNDERWATER, BEFORE YOU TAKE IT ALL THESE TREES.IT'S ALREADY A MAJOR EROSION PROBLEM AND FLOODING PROBLEM.

THIS IS GOING TO ADD TO IT. IF YOU WILL REMOVE 1080 CALIBER INCHES THEY WERE NOT EVEN MITIGATING.

>> THAT SECTION AT THE HEIGHTS IS CURRENTLY 236 INCH RCP.

THAT IS THE PLUG WHAT HOLDS BACK THE FLOW.

I BELIEVE IT BECOMES FOUR OR FIVE MULTIPLE BOX AT THE

CROSSING. >> IT DOES NOT MATTER IF YOU PUT A GIGANTIC BOX, THE CREEK IS STAMPED.

IT DOES NOT FLOW TO THE LAKE, IT IS DAMMED IN MANY PLACES.

IT FLOODS THE ADJACENT PROPERTIES.

>> MAYBE WE CAN SPEAK TOGETHER WITH THIS OFF-LINE BECAUSE I HAVE REVIEWED THE STUDY PERSONALLY AND I HAVE WALKED IT. RESPECTFULLY, I AM NOT SURE.

>> THERE'S ONLY ONE CREEK ON MILLER HEIGHTS THAT DEADENS.

I THINK WE TALKING ABOUT THE SAME AREA.

>> LIKE I SAY, I WALKED IT. BETWEEN THE LAKE ON THE ROAD?

>> YES. THE CREEK GOES, IT DEAD ENDS INTO THE LAKE AND GOES NORTH UNDER THE ROAD AND CONTINUES

NORTH. >> WE ARE AND INSTRUCTION ON A PROJECT TO IMPROVE THE SITUATION .

>> WHAT TECH LESIONS HAVE BEEN DONE REGARDING THE RUNOFF?

>> THE SIZING FOR THE DWNTOWN PEACE PROJECT BEING FULLY DEVELOPED THE TWO RETAIL PADS ARE FULLY CONCRETE CALCULATOR USING A CURVE NUMBER. YOU USE A HIGHER CURVE NUMBER THAT GOES INTO THE HMS MODEL THAT SHOWS THIS AREA, THIS CONCRETE SLAB RATHER THAN A NATURAL EXISTING CONDITION.

THEY RUN THROUGH THE MODEL THAT SHOWS THE CULVERT BEING INSTALL EAST OF HERE IS SIZED FOR THE ULTIMATE CONDITION.

>> IF YOU INCREASE THE SIZE OF THE CULVERT IN THE CREEKS SOUTH OF THE CULVERT HEADED TO THE LAKE IS ALL DAMMED UP AND SILTED IN, THAT IS GOING TO FLOOD THE RESIDENCE PROPERTIES.

>> THEN TO THE SOUTH, THE CREEK NEEDS TO BE DREDGED AGAIN.

THAT WOULD BE THE ANSWER. >> THE DREDGING IS ALREADY

[00:30:15]

DAMMED BY DEBRIS. >> WE WILL HAVE TO SPEAK WITH JEFF.THAT AREA IS OWNED BY THE CITY OF DALLAS.

>> I AM REALLYCONCERNED . HELP ME UNDERSTAND.WITHOUT ALL THIS CONCRETE, THERE IS A FLOODING ISSUE ON MILLER HEIGHTS YOU'RE GOING TO TAKE OUT 1080 CALIBER INCHES OF TREES THAT ARE NOT GOINGTO BE MITIGATED .

YOU WILL PUT ALL OF THOSE ADDITIONAL RUNOFF ON ALL OF THIS CONCRETE THAT IS NOT THERE NOW.

WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN DOWNSTREAM TO THOSE FOLKS ON MILLER HEIGHTS AND BEHIND MILLER HEIGHTS IN THAT DEVELOPMENT THAT ARE ALREADY BEING FLOODED?

>> I CAN TELL YOU AGAIN, THAT HAS BEEN STUDIED AND APPROVED

BY YOUR STAFF IN THAT LOCATION. >> LET ME STEPIN HERE .

I AM NOT THE ENGINEER THAT ADMINISTERS OUR STORMWATER AND FLOODPLAIN ADMINISTRATION, PER MY UNDERSTANDING OF THE REQUIREMENT IS THAT THE POST-DEVELOPMENT RUNOFF IS NOT GREATER THAN THE PRE-DEVELOPMENTRUNOFF .

FURTHER STUDIES THAT THEY HAVE BEEN REQUIRED TO DO, THEY WILL NOT INCREASE THE AMOUNT OF STORMWATER CURRENTLY DOWNSTREAM FROM WHAT IS CURRENTLY COMING PREDEVEOPMENT.

>> ALEX, HOW ARE THEY GOING TO DO THAT?

>> THAT IS WHAT HE IS EXPLAINING.

IT IS IMPROVEMENTS TO THE EXISTING SYSTEM.

IT CHANGES WITH DEVELOPMENT THE OTHER PART B TO THAT, AND I HESITATE SAYING THIS IS THAT THERE IS NOT A REQUIREMENT FOR DEVELOPMENT TO FIX THE FLOODING SITUATIONS.

THEIR ONLY REQUIRED TO NOT MAKE IT WORSE.

>> I UNDERSTAND THAT, ALEX. BUT THE VERY FIRST COMMENT THAT YOU MADE WAS POST RUNOFF WILL NOT EXCEED PREDEVELOPMENT RUNOFF. IF YOU ARE GOING TO PUT ALL OF THIS CONCRETE UP THERE, YOU CAN'T TELL ME THAT THERE IS NOT

MORE RUNOFF. >> I AM NOT AN ENGINEER.

THE OTHER PART THAT I WILL SAY IS THAT THEIR ENGINEERS ARE WORKING WITH OUR ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT ABOUT GETTING AN APPROVED CIVIL SETTHAT INCLUDES STORMWATER MANAGEMENT .

IF THEY CANNOT GET THAT APPROVED, THEY WILL NOT BE ABLE

TO BUILD THIS DEVELOPMENT. >> THANK YOU.

>> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? >> I DO HAVE ONE MORE QUESTION FOR THE ENGINEER. IN YOUR CALCULATIONS, HOW MUCH ADDITIONAL RUNOFF BE CALCULATED?

>> I AM NOT A FLOOD STUDY ENGINEER, THAT SPECIALIZED GROUP THAT DOES THAT. WHEN THAT WAS DONE, I HESITATE TO GET INTO THE SPECIFICS OF IT, BUT ESSENTIALLY WHAT HAPPENS IS THAT WHEN YOU INCREASE THE IMPERVIOUS COVER ON A SITE LIKE THIS, THE WATER GETS TO THE LAKE FASTER THAN WHAT IT WOULD TODAY. YOU ARE OFFSETTING THAT PEAK RAIN EVENTS THAT YOU WOULD EXPERIENCE DOWN YOUR MILLER HEIGHTS . IN A GLOBAL SENSE IS HOW WE WOULDSHOW , HOW THE STUDY SHOW , HOW THE INCREASED IMPERVIOUS COVER FROM THE SITE DOES NOT NEGATIVELY IMPACT THE FOLKS

DOWNSTREAM. >> HOW CAN THAT BE?HAT

DEFIES COMMONSENSE . >> IT'S A TIMING STUDY.

IT'S HARD TO CONVEY WITHOUT GOING INTO THE NITTY-GRITTY OF HOW YOU DO A FLOOD STUDY. WE HAVE REVIEWED IT WITH JEFF.

IT IS SO CLOSE TO THE LAKE IN COMPARISON TO THE REST OF THE BASIN, THAT THE INCREASED IMPERVIOUS COVER FROM THE SITE

[00:35:03]

HEIGHTS. >> IT CAN'T GET TO THE LAKE

BECAUSE THE CREEK IS DAMMED UP. >> I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT DRAINAGE ISSUES. WE HAVE BEEN WORKING ON THE SITE FOR OVER A YEAR WITH CITY STAFF IN THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT. WE ARE HERE FOR A TREE REMOVAL PERMITS. I UNDERSTAND THE CONCERNS ABOU DRAINAGE BUT THEY WERE WORKING ABOUT THAT FOR THE PAST YEAR .

>> I DO UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT TREES ROOT SYSTEMS HELP REDUCE EROSION BY HOLDING THE SOIL IN PLACE.

YOU ARE HERE TELLING US YOU ARE NOT EVEN GOING TO MITIGATE 1080.5 CALIBER INCHES OF TREES. IN THE SAME SENTENCE, YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT I WON'T INCREASE BECAUSE OF THE RUNOFF BECAUSE THE WATER WILL BE FASTER ON CONCRETE.

I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW YOU ARRIVED AT THE CONCLUSION.

>> IS SIMILAR TO WHAT MR. COTE WAS SAYING.

THE WATER RUNS OFF THE CONCRETE FASTER AND GET OUT BEFORE THE

REST OF THE PEAK. >> AS ALEX SAID, ALL OF THESE THINGS UP AND LOOKED AT MUCH MORE CLOSELY IN THE ENGINEERING PLANS THEMSELVES. THEY HAVE TO ACCOUNT FOR IT.

OUR IN-HOUSE ENGINEERS WOULD MAKE DARN SURE THAT IS GOING TO

BETAKING CARE OF . >> JEFF AND I HAVE SPENT PROBABLY FIVE MEETINGS ON THE STUFF AT THIS POINT.

>> ON THE TREES OR WATER RUNOFF?

>> IS ALL THE SAME TOPIC. THEY ARE NOT MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE

ISSUES. >> I THINK WE MADE A POINT TONIGHT THAT THERE ARE SOME CONCERNS.

I HOPE YOU GENTLEMEN WILL KEEP THAT IN MIND AS YOU MOVE FORWARD WITH THE ENGINEERING PLANS.

>> I WISH I COULD HAVE BROUGHT THE FULL STUDY WILL BE APPROVED TONIGHT TO SHOW IT TO YOU TO GO THROUGH IT IN EXCRUCIATING DETAIL WITH YOU. I DO NOT REALIZE IT WAS GOING TO BE A HOT TOPIC. HEARING THERE IS A CONCERN THAT MILLERHEIGHTS IS NOT A SURPRISE TO ME .

>> TREES REDUCE RUNOFF BY THE LEAFY CANOPY SPIRIT THAT CATCHES A LOT OF RAIN AND WAS LEFT OVER THE GROUND.

IT'S ALL GOING TO HIT THE GROUND WHEN YOU REMOVE ALL OF

THESE TREES. >> MAN, I CAN GUARANTEE YOU THAT IS A CONSIDERATION THE STUDIES THAT HAVE BEEN DONE.

>> OKAY, THANK YOU. A STAIRWAY FOR YOU TO REPOSITION THE BUILDINGS AND SAVE SOME MORE TREES? YOU ARE ASKING US TO APPROVE CUTTING DOWN 130 OUT OF 140 TREES? COULDN'T THERE BE A BIGGER EFFORT TO MAYBE MOVE THINGS AROUND AND SAVE SOME MORE TREE

. >> A COUPLE OFTHOUGHTS THERE .

THAT 140 NUMBERS DOES NOT INCLUDEANY OF THE GREENBELT .

WE DO NOT COUNT THAT TO ADD TO THE REMAINING TREE COVER.

THIS WHOLE GREENBELT TO THE NORTH, WHEN YOU COME UP WITH THE RIGHT HAND SIDE OF THE STREET, I WILL HAVE A NUMBER FOR YOU. OUR INTENT WAS TO MAINTAIN THAT. IS THERE ANY WAY TO REDUCE IT? THERE IS NOT. THE SITE IS BUILT TO A 20 FOOT BUILDING LINE AND THAT REQUIRES THE BLOCKING OF IT ENDS UP LEADING UP THE WHOLE DEVELOPER AREA.

AS IT WAS PLOTTING HERE, IT HAS THIS VISION OF THE ROAD

[00:40:02]

REDUCE THAT. >> CHAIR: ANY QUESTIONS?

MR. ENGEN. >> JUST TO FOLLOW UP ON COMMISSIONERWILLIAMS . I HAVE BEEN OVER IN THAT AREA WITHOUT CREEK FLOWS. I REMEMBER LAST YEAR WE HAD 8 INCHES OF RAIN IN AUGUST. A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT LIVED DOWNSTREAM, THEIR BACKYARDS WERE ALL FLOODED AND I WAS OVER THERE AFTER THATTIME . IT IS NOT GOOD.

THAT SOUNDS LIKE AN EXISTING PROBLEM.

I CERTAINLY HOPE THAT THE CITY WILL BE ABLE TO CONTROL THAT.

8 INCHES ALWAYS A LOT OF RAIN AND IT IS SURFACE WATER MOVING TOWARDS THE LAKE. BUT WHEN YOU START ADDING THE ADDITIONAL CONCRETE IN THE HOUSING DEVELOPMENTS, THERE ARE SOME CONCERNS. I UNDERSTAND THAT WE ARE HERE FOR THE MITIGATION ON THE TREE .

I THINK WE AS COMMISSIONERS WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE CITY IS RIGHT IN THEIR FAX BEFORE WE MOVE FORWARD ON ANYTHING.

THAT IS JUST MY OPINION. >> WOULD IT MAKE SENSE TO HAVE A CONTINUANCE AND GET STAFF TO SHOW YOU THE WORK WE HAVE DONE THE ENGINEERING TEAM TO SHOW YOU AND GET MORE OUT OF THE WATER STUDY? DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?

>> THAT IS OUR MAJOR CONCERN OF WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN GOING DOWNSTREAM. YOU ARE PUTTING IN A LOT OF TREES TO RECTIFY AND YOU WILL EVEN THAT ONE AREA GREEN.

WE JUST WANT TO MAKE CERTAIN. THE GOALIES HAVE GOTTEN VERY DEEP BECAUSE OF THE RAMPANT WATERFORD IF WE WANT TO GET BACK TO TALKING ABOUT A FASTER PACE, LIKE MS. WILLIAMS WAS SAYING, HE WILL HAVE A LOT MORE EROSION GOING ON.

THE CITY IS CONVINCED THAT WHATEVER YOU ARE - - CONVINCED THE COMMISSIONERS IT IS GOING TO WORK RIGHT.

>> THANK YOU COMMISSIONER ENGEN.>> CHAIR: ANY MORE QUESTIONS? THANK YOU VERY MUCH SETTLEMENT

WILL BE APPRECIATED. >> I WANT TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND, THE APPLICANT IS OKAY WITH US STABLING THIS?

>> YES, WE WILL GET STAFF ON BOARD THE SHOW YOU THE DRAINAGE STUDIES WE HAVE DONE. JUST WANT TO GIVE EVERYONE THE SAME PAGE. MAYBE PUSH IT TO THE NEXT PLANNING AND ZONING MEETING, DOES THAT MAKE SENSE?

>> ALEX, IS THAT GOOD WITH YOU? >> YES, I WOULD MAKE A REQUEST WITH OUR BEST INTENTIONS WE HAVE THIS FOR THE NEXT MEETING IN TWO WEEKS BUT DID NOT MAKE IT SPECIFIC TO THAT JUST IN

CASE SOMETHING GOES AWRY. >> OKAY, I'M READY FOR A

MOTION. >> I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT WE TABLE THIS PROJECT AND HOPEFULLY MEET BACK

HERE. >> THIS ITEM, THAT THE WHOLE

PROJECT. >> TABLE THIS MOTION WITH REGARDS TO MITIGATION AND THE WATER WENT OFF SITUATION SO WE ARE NOT CREATING ANY BIGGER PROBLEMS AND THE DEVELOPER WILL BOTH BRING HIS TEAM IN THE CITY SO WE ARE OF A COORDINATED EFFORT ON HOW IT WILL CONTROL THE WATER.

>> CHAIR: WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR THE TABLE ITEM 4A FOR TWO WEEKS. IF FOR SOME REASON,THE TEAM CANNOT, AND IN TWO WEEKS, WE CAN EXTEND THAT .

I AM READY FOR A SECOND. >> I SECOND.

[00:45:01]

>> GO AHEAD JOHN. >> ,JUST GO AHEAD AND TABLE THE ITEM? NO TIMEFRAME.

>> I'M FINE WITH THAT. >> WE HAVE A MOTION TO TABLE ITEM, DO WE HAVE A SECOND? WE HAVE A SECOND MEMBERS WILLIAM, ALL IN FAVOR? THAT IS UNANIMOUS AND WE

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.